Talk:Main Page

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	--[[User:Waldo|Waldo]] 04:46, 29 Apr 2005 (CDT)		--[[User:Waldo|Waldo]] 04:46, 29 Apr 2005 (CDT)
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		+	FWIW here is a [http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_Update_to_GNOME_2.10 sample HOWTO] I wrote for gentoo. This was the first one I wrote, and it was really easy w/the templates... see how it fits w/the entire site?
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		+	--[[User:Waldo|Waldo]] 05:25, 29 Apr 2005 (CDT)
	== Random Quotes Idea ==		== Random Quotes Idea ==

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Revision as of 10:25, 29 April 2005

Contents 1 Style/Formatting Guide 2 Random Quotes Idea 3 More Notes - Proper Page Nameing 3.1 All Pages Renamed! 4 Main_Page content questions and discussion 5 Notes from the jake-of-all-trades 6 Status of migration from the old wiki 6.1 What's Been Done 6.2 What's Left To Do 7 Wiki software successfully installed. 8 Old Discussion on adopting MediaWiki as the new NeoWiki 8.1 New Section 8.2 More sections 8.3 Another section

Style/Formatting Guide

Do we need to have a "style guide" to standardize how we represent certain functions or types of info?

We have three "regular editors" now, plus a fair amount of legacy content from the old wiki (which had another handful of editors/contributors). We seem to represent only one type of thing consistently among the three of us + legacy content:

• paths (incl. paths ending with a filename) or terminal commands

Other things seem to vary widely:

• Menus submenus (: or -> or something else)

• Menus (standalone in text, i.e., Choose the Tools menu--sometimes boldface)

• Filenames (standalone--seem to be mostly typewriter or boldface)

• "Dialogue/window titles" or "Preference Option Name" (sometimes boldface, sometimes in "quotes")

Should we agree on a wiki style for the latter types and adhere to it from here on out, and clean up the older stuff as we get time or modify those article?

--sardisson 04:27, 29 Apr 2005 (CDT)

Good question. Having worked on a Gentoo wiki or too, i have to say I was impressed with their templates that give a unified look to the whole thing. I think a style guide is not a bad idea.. here are some suggestions.

1. bold all filenames, menu items, application names, or any text string that appears on-screen. this will facilitate readability tremendously, especially when following instructions.
2. put "pre" or "tt" tags around all typed Terminal commands (or use something similar to the gentoo templates.)
3. When describing procedures to be done that involve rooting through menus, list the menu items in the order they appear to the user. for example: "In the menu bar, under the File item, select Save."
4. I think that writing directions out in English has several advantages over the "Item 1 > Item 2" method of indicating options/navigation. For one thing, there is not much room for misunderstanding when you say "Make sure that the whatever radio button is selected." or "Press the Ok button to continue." Also, it is more accessible, I think, to a newbie user who may not be familiar with the 'item->item' shorthand.
5. When issuing a series of instructions, I think it's always a good idea to express to the user what will happen next, ie "Press the Ok button. A window labeled Preferences will appear."

I'm sure I'll think of more style stuff... this is just a start.. I think the gentoo wiki templates really help unify the site and the navigation stuff facilitates site organization and helps you get around easily.

--Waldo 04:46, 29 Apr 2005 (CDT)

FWIW here is a sample HOWTO I wrote for gentoo. This was the first one I wrote, and it was really easy w/the templates... see how it fits w/the entire site?

--Waldo 05:25, 29 Apr 2005 (CDT)

Random Quotes Idea

I wish that MediaWiki had an option to do a "random quote"-- ie, something like:

?This is quote one|this is quote two|etc?

where every time you loaded the page, one of the above choices would appear.

Why?

I'd love to see random testimonials like this on the front page:

"I am in love" --AnonyCoward

"Tx to all of you guys to make this wonderful alternative to MS Office." --PD150

"I downloaded Neooffice yesterday and am flabbergasted" --Falk

etc

--Waldo 22:08, 21 Apr 2005 (CDT)

That would be cool! Can we suggest it for the next version?

--sardisson 10:11, 22 Apr 2005 (CDT)

I suppose it couldn't hurt to try. Maybe the other idea is to do a page of endorsements, complements, thanks, and kudos from the public and just link to it.. call it "testimonials" or something..?

--Waldo 14:21, 22 Apr 2005 (CDT)

More Notes - Proper Page Nameing

For page names, use spaces. NeoOffice/J Screenshots looks better than NeojScreenshots as a page header. =) AND media wiki lets us.

been doing some editing of the community and editing help, and random pages. some make sense, some are just partial notes to me of what i want it to say, so don't be afraid to add on.

-j

-- 12:06, 1 Feb 2005 (CST)

There's a two-step process to completely fixing our naming problem.

1. Go the the page you want to rename
2. Open the "What links here" link (in the sidebar toolbox) in a new window/tab
3. Click the "move" tab at the top of the page you want to rename
4. Enter a new name, e.g. NeoOffice/J Screenshots and move the page and associated talk, if applicable; this moves the page to the new name and brings the history, etc., along.
5. Go to each of the pages in the "What links here" page and fix the links, e.g. NeoOffice/J_Screenshots
   1. MediaWiki will automatically redirect arrivals at the old page to the new (moved/renamed) page but we want to phase the old ones out and keep the links up to date.
      1. I really love the "What links here" and "Move" features!
   2. I've already done NeoOffice/J Screenshots (sorry, Jake, you'll have to update the NeoOffice.org links again, but for now people are just redirected with a little notice at the top of the destination)

OK, I guess that wasn't exactly two steps. Conceptually it's two steps :-)

P.S. the noeditheader thing is really nice. I assume that's going into the template so we don't have to add it to every page manually?

--sardisson 17:26, 1 Feb 2005 (CST)

BTW, each header is also turned into an anchor, if you ever want to point people to a specific section of a page...thus, the "status of migration from the old wiki" section below can be targetted as http://neowiki.sixthcrusade.com/index.php?title=Talk:Main_Page#Status_of_migration_from_the_old_wiki (that's a mouthful!)

--sardisson 00:00, 24 Mar 2005 (CST)

All Pages Renamed!

At least I think so. Plus, anytime you want to link to the main NeoJ wiki page, you can just do [[NeoOffice/J]] and the wiki will interpret it as NeoOffice/J—no need to do the piped link thing anymore.

--sardisson 03:37, 27 Mar 2005 (CST)

Main_Page content questions and discussion

When did we lose "NeoOffice/J" or the like from the first sentence below Welcome? We talk about 3 apps on the main page; which of them is the "Mac OS X port of OpenOffice.org"? Or are we meaning that generically? People who visit the main page might be confused?

--sardisson 18:33, 28 Mar 2005 (CST)

i put NeoOffice back in... there is a definate confusion i think amounst all of the NeoOffice pages about what Neo really is. I've started talking to Ed and Patrick about it. so, more to follow. -- 11:47, 29 Mar 2005 (CST)

I thought back in December it was decided to go with "NeoOffice/J" through the 1.x releases and "NeoOffice" once it hit 2.0 and had "full" aquafication?

I think we need to try and get "NeoOffice" out of use for a while as an app name ("NeoOffice.org" and "the NeoOffice project[s]" excepted) because "NeoOffice" the app still means NeoOffice/C to a lot of people (hard to promote the new name of an app if the app was renamed after development ceased :D), and it's confusing to use NeoOffice for /J, too.... Anyway. My head is foggy tonight.... --sardisson 01:12, 30 Mar 2005 (CST)

FWIW I agree.. I'd use neooffice/J and /C up until the 2.0 release. I think that's clearer. The downside is people think it's written in java, but oh well. --Waldo 14:14, 30 Mar 2005 (CST)

Notes from the jake-of-all-trades

Ok, so I found out more about the skins. they are generated almost entirely by PHP. This is good, my PHP is better than my CSS, but this also means that i have to be careful as to not break anything. I'll play with it some later. Main things, to see about moving some of the top things to 'logged in only' mode and to get more links on the side (to match the main page)

Ideally I'd make a page that looked just like Tavi for the unlogged, and then when you logged in this would be what you saw, but we'll see.

THe front page (neooffice.org) should be updated.

I was trying to think of a way we could make a 'developer' page for us to discuss the wiki (maybe even experiment) without getting in the way of the main site. more to follow.

-j ps. chimera doesn't like the editing type buttons.

What "editing type buttons"? And why are you still using Chimera? -sa

the buttons at the top of the edit window, you know dig sig and things like that. and i use chimera because i don't like camino. (see rant in trinity)

-- 07:00, 1 Feb 2005 (CST)

Ah, well, they do work in Camino. I missed the rant but I'll look it up :-)

--sardisson 17:26, 1 Feb 2005 (CST)

Status of migration from the old wiki

Quick note from waldo: I brought everything over from the old wiki. At least I think i did. Note that some of the link names ahve changed to be more uniform and/or compliant with the neo->neo/c change. --W

Unfortunately, sardisson, Ovvldc, and others continued to edit the old wiki until it was defaced and closed on 19 Jan 2005. So we have to update every page (and some newly-created pages) to get back in sync. Remember to verify that the link/page names are the same here, r.f. Waldo above fixing our Neo->Neo/C mess :-) Plus that NeoWiki:Copyrights link at the bottom needs its details :-)

MediaWiki creates its titles/splits words on underscores (Rv_Bm not RvBm; displayed as Rv Bm), for future links.

What's Been Done

• The "Neo/J Tips and Hints" section is now up-to-date with the old wiki. --sardisson 02:40, 21 Jan 2005 (CST)

• The "OpenOffice.org/X11" section should now be up-to-date with the old wiki. --sardisson 03:10, 21 Jan 2005 (CST)

• The entire Neo/J section is now be up-to-date with the old wiki (plus some new items). --sardisson 04:52, 21 Jan 2005 (CST)

• The Neo/C section is now up-to-date with the old wiki (within the framework of Waldo's simplifed page structure) --sardisson 00:42, 25 Jan 2005 (CST)

• The More info section is now up-to-date with the old wiki --sardisson 00:42, 25 Jan 2005 (CST)

This means the migration is complete!

What's Left To Do

• Templates (let's hide some of these wacky headers, tabs, edit buttons, and get a larger default font?)

Here's the MediaWiki CSS reference http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_styles (next time I have a weekend.... sardsson)

• Plus that NeoWiki:Copyrights link at the bottom needs its details :-)

---

Wiki software successfully installed.

Please see documentation on customizing the interface and the User's Guide for usage and configuration help.

Old Discussion on adopting MediaWiki as the new NeoWiki

New Section

WikiWords don't seem to work here; unsure whether this is good or bad.

Overall, MediaWiki will take a little bit of getting used to (the new/different formatting conventions in the wiki), but it seems nice enough in my limited time playing around (hmm, how do I set my timezone?) If it can lock it down a bit (so that people at least must log in--deter the casual folks who I think are the ones messing with things now) it might be worth it, if Jake feels he can get the template set up OK.

Lots of pages in the old wiki are only linked from one other page, so care will be needed bringing it over....

--sardisson 23:11, 30 Dec 2004 (CST)

More sections

I personally dislike WikiWords because they are too techie and frequently you do not want them to link. Time zone is set in your preferences page, BTW. I find MediaWiki nice to administer as well, though I haven't tried editing the skins.

New version (1.4.0) is coming out soon (I helped test it - busy little ant). Not that many new features that you'll need here, though.

BTW, you can set it up to only allow registered users to edit by putting the following line into your localsetting.php:

$wgWhitelistEdit = true;

Ovvldc 19:05, 1 Jan 2005 (CST)

Another section

So, I now think this looks really busy, too many little "edit" buttons all over and tocs and links and so forth. (Thanks, Waldo, for bringing everything over...it made things easier to see in a real-life comparison!) Don't know if editing the templates can help here or not. Hmm. What're the latest feelings about this, jake?

--sardisson 02:27, 14 Jan 2005 (CST)

i think the style of the media wiki is to have all of those edits.

however, that should be a sign, if there are 'too many' edits, the page is probably too long (unless it is a FAQ or something) and perhaps some organization is needed.

(?)

It puts the little edit thing every place you have a header/section. I've turned them, and the annoying tables-of-contents, off in my user prefs, so it's surely possible to disable them in your new template, too :-) I think the place the "edits" most bothered me was on the main page and now the FAQ....

-sa